Bush: Foot In Mouth
President George W. Bush is at it again. During a Thursday press conference in Washington, our brain-locked leader uttered the following in an attempt to defend his 2003 invasion of Iraq. Appearantly, we were forced to act because no leader could emerge to stop the sectarian bloodshead:
“I heard somebody say, ‘Where’s Mandela?’ Well, Mandela’s dead because Saddam Hussein killed all the Mandelas.”
Nelson Mandela, 89, South Africa’s first black president and a Nobel Peace Prize winner, is still very much alive.
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There are 24 Comments to "Bush: Foot In Mouth"
Serious question (one I hope you’ll answer):
Where do you think Bush got the idea that Saddam Hussein killed Nelson Mandela?
(along with any clones of Nelson Mandela, apparently, since Bush seems to think that Hussein killed every single one of him).
I can only assume that he was speaking rhetorically, as in “Saddam killed liberty,” but with Bush, it’s hard to be sure.
And remember, GWB hates the idea of cloning, going so far as stonewalling stem cell research to insure that it won’t happen. He may have even subsidized Saddam to kill those clones before the invasion.
If he was speaking rhetorically, does it follow that he thought Nelson Mandela literally dead?
He must have. It sounds like one of those off-the-cuff remarks that his handlers live in mortal fear of.
It seems that by marking it as rhetorical speech that you must necessarily leave the door open for the idea that Bush did not think Nelson Mandela literally dead.
But now you add that it “sounds like” a gaffe. Can you be more specific?
Someone from the crowd asked, “Where’s Mandela?”
The President then replied that he–and his clones–were dead, killed by Saddam. Sounds like one of the reasons Bush is rarely put in front of a live audience to me.
Manfred, what makes you think the president heard someone in the crowd ask about Mandela?
I don’t see that in the story you linked. Please don’t tell me that you’re looking into the background, now.
The President did remark, “I heard somebody say, ‘Where’s Mandela?’”
I simply drew an inference that he heard a comment from the crowd. Maybe not, but he heard it somewhere.
What is your explanation of the incident, Bryan?
It will mean so much more to you if you figure it out on your own, Manfred.
There is local reconciliation taking place. I had a fascinating conversation in the Roosevelt Room earlier this week with members of provincial reconstruction teams from around Iraq who talked about how people are sick and tired of murder and violence, and that they expect their local governments and their central government to be more responsive to their needs, and local governments are beginning to respond.
Part of the reason why there is not this instant democracy in Iraq is because people are still recovering from Saddam Hussein’s brutal rule. I thought an interesting comment was made when somebody said to me, I heard somebody say, where’s Mandela? Well, Mandela is dead, because Saddam Hussein killed all the Mandelas.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2007/09/20070920-2.html
Still think he heard it from the crowd? Follow the link and you can watch the press conference with audio. I didn’t hear anything like that from the crowd–maybe you’ll have better luck.
Hint:
http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0907/Crocker_No_Nelson_Mandela_in_Iraq.html
Well, I suppose the commentary section is filtered to protect against spam or something. Unless I’ve been banned for normal conversation.
Not as easy to let you figure it out on your own without using URLs, but I’ll give it a try.
http://www. whitehouse. gov/news/releases/2007/09/20070920-2. html
September 11, 2007
Read More: Iraq
Crocker: No Nelson Mandela in Iraq
As you see, I recovered your original comment from the spam bin. Don’t know why it ended up there; only ads for drugs, porn, etc. are supposed to be filtered, not political stuff. I’ll have my Tech VP get on it right away.
No time to examine it now, as I have to leave for work. Check back later.
Thanks for rummaging around in there to rescue the original.
I really wish I knew where Bush got this stuff, but it makes you wonder if it is a clever ploy. Noone can mess up this much accidentally could they?
I knew he heard that line somewhere, Bryan–although I didn’t realize he’d stolen it from Crocker. Funny, huh? It would seem that Bush took the Ambassador’s figurative comment literally.
On second thought, it’s not so funny, since the Iraqis have been “at each others throats” long before Saddam, and continue to be now that he’s gone. It only says that brutality–or force– is all that will work. I don’t think its a very positive outlook for the near future.
Why does it “seem that Bush too the [a]mbassador’s figurative comment literally” in your opinion?
What is the specific evidence that you used in drawing that conclusion? The same kind of evidence that led you to conclude that somebody from the crowd asked “Where’s Mandela?”
If you have another opinion, you’ll have to give it to me; I’m obviously too thickheaded to comprehend where you are going with this, and I don’t like riddles.
Do you expect me to believe that Bush is some kind of political genius, throwing off brilliancies that only those who agree with his POV understand, but which all of us should take to heart? If so, say it plainly. If not, tell me what you ARE getting at.
You were able to answer why you thought Bush was fielding a question from the crowd, so why is this question (What is the specific evidence that you used in drawing that conclusion?) any tougher?
Take your ease, Manfred. I’ll be back later to explain it to you point by point.
Very well, you tell me what specific evidence you used to draw your conclusion, and what that conclusion might be. I’m all ears.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1KGwQ1O88Y
That’s the link to YouTube video of Bush saying the words in question. You may want to refer to it as I make my case.
1) You’ve already seen the evidence that Mandela was used by Crocker to symbolically compare to the lack of effective unifying leadership in Iraq. Not only did Crocker make a statement along those lines, but so did Condoleezza Rice.
http://www.usembassy.org.uk/iraq841.html
2. As I’ve pointed out, Bush specifically referred to a conversation in the Roosevelt Room before he referred to somebody’s “interesting comment.”
3. Is the following an interesting comment:
“Where’s Mandela?”
?
4. Now, you can just use the conclusion you’re trying to reach (Bush is stupid) to assume that Bush thinks that “Where’s Mandela?” is an interesting question in the context of Iraqi reconstruction and reconciliation, but if you’re trying to work from the evidence to reach the conclusion instead of using the conclusion to interpret the evidence I wouldn’t recommend it.
5. It is overwhelmingly likely that Bush thought the issue of Mandela interesting because of the figurative application to contemporary Iraqi politics. See point #6.
6. Bush probably was referring to more than “Where’s Mandela?” as the “interesting comment.” He was probably quoting/paraphrasing the full exchange he heard in the Roosevelt Room. Watch the YouTube account and listen to the intonation. Bush sustains a different delivery right up through the part about Hussein killing all the Mandelas.
7. Following from point #6, Bush did not say anything about Mandela himself. He quoted what somebody else said about Mandela. Even if you wish to suppose that the original speaker though Mandela literally dead (a stretch in itself), there’s no evidence at all that Bush agreed with that proposition.
* I hate to admit it, but intellectual honesty compels me to note that Bush’s comments yesterday about Mandela being “dead,” really were misconstrued.
http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/12962.html
Here’s the account from Dana Milbank (WaPo reporter who actually attends the press conferences):
http://www.registerguard.com/news/2007/09/21/a3.nat.mandela.0921.p1.php?section=nation_world
I think I’ve offended your filtration system again.
I must apologize, I suppose, for being taken in by a perfectly respectable news outlet.
I do not think Bush is stupid, I think he is misguided. And he does have a habit–no offense–of making miscues on camera.
No offense taken. Bush should not be mistaken for a composed extemporaneous speaker. But the media should be more careful
Reuters ran the original story, by the way, and they’re doing quite a bit of damage to their reputation lately (same organization that gave us Photoshopped photos from Lebanon about a year ago).